Sunday, October 22, 2023

How Mormons Should Think About The War In Israel

Douglas Casey recently described what’s happening in the Middle East as "a dog's breakfast."  That's a 19th century British colloquialism you don't often hear these days, but I've never seen it used so aptly.  No matter how disgusting the carnage before him, a dog will mindlessly attack and devour his chosen meal even it it utimately kills him.  You can't pull a determined dog off or get him to slow down. 

So as we consider this current dog's breakfast of a mess in Palestine, let us begin with two undeniable truths:

1. Hamas is wicked, vengeful, bloodthirsty and brutal.  

2. The government of Israel is wicked, vengeful, bloodthirsty, and brutal. 

Neither side is willing to slow down or take a breath and consider the chaos they are causing. Both sides are wholly focused on only one aim: to devour without stopping to pause. 

Notice I'm not blaming the Jewish or Arab people for this mess.  On both sides, it is the people who are  suffering and dying, not the leaders of Hamas and certainly not the Zionist government of Israel.  The Arab people of Palestine did not elect Hamas to represent them, yet the payback for the initial attacks that have brought on this war are falling squarely on the heads of the people living in Gaza. In return, countless innocent Jews will be slaughtered.  And on and on it will go, back and forth, back and forth, drawing entire nations into the fray as everyone assumes they must choose sides.

So what should be our response as members of the body of Christ? 

That should be simple: God commands us in Doctrine & Covenants 98 to "renounce war and proclaim peace," and to "turn the hearts of the Jews unto the prophets."  Most importantly (and the part of that section most Mormons are wont to overlook), is verse 32, where the Lord makes clear that His people are not to go out unto battle against any nation, kindred, tongue, or people unless the Lord Himself commands them. What we definitely should not be doing is choosing to take one side over another in this war of annihilation.

And yet I'm seeing and hearing from devout members of the Church of Jesus Christ demanding retribution against the Palestinian people for a horror most of those people had nothing to do with. I hear some of my Mormon brethren cheering on the state of Israel with cries of "crush them!" "wipe them off the map!" "we should finish them once and for all!" and other alarming cries for revenge. 

Seeing these bloodthirsty calls for vengeance reminded me of why the prophet Mormon threw down his sword and refused to continue as leader of the Nephite armies. After a successful series of battles wherein the Nephites had successfully driven back their Lamanite attackers, they got all full of themselves and decided that merely driving the enemy back was not enough. They aimed to go into the borders of the Lamanites and completely destroy that entire civilization. "Cut them off from the face of the land" is how they put it.

That's when their general called it quits.  Defending against invaders was one thing. Becoming the invader and taking a war of vengeance into the enemy's borders was something else.  It would result in the mass murder of Lamanites -including women and children- who had never come against the Nephites in the first place. Mormon simply would not have it. In case you don't remember what happened, this aggressive action on the part of the Nephites resulted in the complete annihilation of their entire civilization a mere ten years later.  Today there are no Nephites on the American continent. But the Lamanites are still here.  I'd say there's a lesson in there for us.

Now, I don't want you to get the impression I'm siding with Hamas in this controversy.   When it comes to this war between the residents of Gaza and the pretend "State of Israel," as Mormons and as Americans we should not be rooting for either side.  And as an American and a Mormon who has read the scriptural warnings, I also take that position as a descendant of Judah.

My Secret Life As A Crypto-Jew  
My maternal grandmother, Elsie Reichert, was five years old when she arrived at Ellis Island with her parents and siblings sometime in the late 1880s. Her family were Prussian Jews, come to America to escape the constant pogroms in the old world.  Like many other Jews at the time, the Reicherts chose to hide their Jewish heritage right then and there. Being a Jew had become just too much trouble for a growing number of Eastern Europeans, and some of them simply gave themselves a new name when passing through the immigration process.  A new country meant a new life; why not start out with a completely new identity as well?

Unlike other crypto-Jews, Great Grandma and Grandpa Reichert didn't have to change their last name in order to pass as gentiles. The surname Reichert was a neutral cognomen; it wasn't a name like Feldman or Finkelstein that instantly marked one as being Jewish.  Back in the old world there were Jews named Reichert to be sure, but there were also plenty of Germans with that same last name. Or maybe all those teutonic Reicherts were actually Jews secretly hiding their identities, who knows?   I can only tell you that when I was young I was told that my mother's family came from Germany. Even that story was false; they came from Prussia.

The fact that we actually derived from Jewish stock was unknown to us kids while we were growing up, although looking back there were plenty of clues I was too young to notice.  But Grandma hid our true heritage from the family so well that I don't know if she herself even knew she was a Jew; it's possible her parents never told her.  We kids found out after we were grown up, long after Grandma had died.  My mother and my Aunt Rose were the family geneologists, and that's how the secret leaked out. As Aunt Rose cryptically put it, somewhere back in our family tree "there was a Jew in the woodpile."

Under Jewish law and custom, if your mother was Jewish that makes you Jewish as well. Grandma Reichert Law gave birth to my mother, which under the law makes my mother Jewish. When I passed through my mother's birth canal in the Naval hospital at Oceanside, California...L'Chaim! I arrived in America an instant Jew!  Although I embrace Mormonism as my religion, by birth I am considered to be of the tribe of Judah. That's how it works. 

This Land Ain't Mine
My reason for bringing all this up is that, like a lot of Jews (and an overwhelming number of evangelical Christians who have misread the scriptures), I bought into the fable that in these modern times God desired His people to return to their Jewish homeland. "This land is mine," goes the stirring song from the 1960 film Exodus, "God gave this land to me."

Well, no it isn't, and no He didn't. God allowed the Assyrians and the Babylonians to take it away from us thousands of years ago when Judah and the other eleven tribes of Israel rebelled against Him. As much as that song still plays on my emotions to this day, I now recognize it as simple propaganda.  The fact is, this push to create a politically constructed homeland for the Jews in Palestine is antithetical to the will of God as clearly demonstrated in scripture. That is the stone-cold truth, and no amount of sentimental movie making is going to change that reality.

As a descendant of the tribe of Judah, when I have a question about Jewish orthodoxy, I don't look to mawkish songs and movies for my doctrine.  If I want to know whether God intended for the Jews to return to Palestine and push out its current residents, I'll look to the Torah, as these and many other orthodox Rabbis have been doing for decades: 

You may never have been told that hundreds of thousands of devout descendants of Judah assert that Zionism is diametrically opposed to Judaism.  They recognize that the phony Zionist "State of Israel" is a violation of the covenant that all of Israel made before God, and have for decades worked to expose the fraud.   A distant relative of mine, Irving Reichert, was the prominent Rabbi of San Francisco's Temple Emanu-El and he made headlines back in 1943 when he issued a Yom Kippur warning against the growing Zionist threat to Judaism. 

This was a good five years before the United Nations decreed, without consulting God, that the land of  Palestine was forthwith to be the new Jewish homeland.  Rabbi Reichert was alarmed at how many American Jews were already being taken in by the smooth-talking promoters of Zionism behind that decree.  Let's face it, even though the idea contradicted scripture, the idea of the Jews once again having a homeland of their own was very appealing.  As for Zionism: who wouldn't be attracted to the idea of a return to Zion?  "Zion!"  The very name is familiar to all Jews from their scriptures; it evokes images of peace, protection, rest, and refuge. 

But Israel today is far from a place of refuge.  And how could it be? The early founders of Zionism were not religious Jews, and they didn't have anything resembling a true Zion in mind. These early promoters were euphemistically known as "secular Jews," which is a nice way of saying they were Jews by birth but that they didn't practice the religion. Many of them were avowed atheists not motivated in the least by religious Judaism. For secular Jews, the religion of Judaism holds little appeal.  What they wanted was a massive tract of real estate and the power that goes with being in control of a country.  Theodore Herzl, Ben-Gurion, Menachem Begin -these were all unbelievers tirelessy working to deceive the believers.  Even the Prime Minister of Israel today is an atheist.  His real name isn't even Netanyahu, it's Mileikovsky. "Netanyahu" is a made up name meaning "God has given us."  This faker leads his followers into believing God has given him to them as some sort of modern messiah. This man who has the effrontery to incorporate God's name "Yehu" into his own is a liar and a mass murderer who will deserve his final reward.

It should be noted that prior to the establishment of a political "state of Israel," there were already plenty of Jews, Arabs, and even Christians living together in harmony in the Holy Land. In his 1943 Yom Kippur address, Rabbi Reichert made clear that he was in favor of continued opportunities for all persecuted and uprooted peoples of Europe to re-establish themselves in that area if that is what they want.  Jews have always had the right to move to the Holy Land if they want to.  They are simply prohibited by Torah from arriving in might, or as Jewish law puts it, to "go up as a wall" to claim a divine entitlement to be there, or to displace those already living in the area.

According to the Rabbi, individual Jews and their families were entitled to live whereever they could peacefully dwell, but for the Jews to establish a political nation was sinful and a violation of the religion of Judah.  Rabbi Reichert reminded his followers that the basis of unity among Jews is religion, not political nationalism. He contended that Jews should and do consider themselves nationals of those countries in which they live, and those various lands their homelands. He saw the Jewish problem, tragic and appalling as it is, in the last analysis a part of the world problem. Eventually it will have to be settled in those countries where Jews reside. The creation of a Jewish state in Palestine will not solve the problem of Jews living in other countries, Reichert maintained. On the contrary, he said, it may well aggravate them.

Well, the good Rabbi was certainly prescient on that last point. Relations between Jews and non-Jews the world over have never been worse than they have been since the creation of the State of Israel.  And remember, Rabbi Reichert said all this eighty years ago, long before American Jews would ever suspect their beloved land of Israel would one day become a bloody war zone, or that members of their own tribe here in America would angrily demand the wholesale slaughter of Judah's neighbors.

The Law vs. The Myth
Nearly everything the Zionists have proposed contradicts Jewish law as embodied in the Torah.  If you want to have your eyes opened on this subject, just dip in anywhere at the website True Torah Jews.  I particularly like the page that features Rabbinic Quotations, which go as far back as 1050 A.D., all of which give the lie to the scam currently being perpetrated by the Zionist State counterfeiters. Here are just a few I've chosen that prove the Jews are not permitted to return to the Holy Land and there create a political state complete with armies and navies as they have now done:

(Note: for those not familiar with Hebrew, "Eretz Yisroel" means "the land of Israel."  "Yaakov and Esav" are "Jacob and Esau," "Mitzvah" is one's duty to obey God by behaving kindly toward others, "Hashem" means "the name" and is simply a common way some orthodox Jews refer to God so as to not risk profaning His name.) 

Rabbi Moshe Ben Nachman, the Ramban (1194-1270):
The Ramban holds that permission granted by a gentile government for Jews to return to Eretz Yisroel does not nullify the oaths they have taken to obey Hashem.
Rabbi Ishtori Haparchi, author of Kaftor Vaferach (1280-1366):
The book Kaftor Vaferach, written in 1322, details the geography of Eretz Yisroel and discusses the great mitzvah to live there: "It was taught in the name of Rabbi Meir: Whoever establishes his residence in Eretz Yisroel, speaks the Holy Tongue, eats only ritually clean food and recites Shema morning and evening is guaranteed the World to Come (Yerushalmi Shkalim 14b). However, they must not go up with the intent of conquering until the end arrives, as it states in the end of tractate Kesubos: Do not arouse or awaken... Rabbi Zeira says: This teaches that Israel must not go up as a wall." (Kaftor Vaferach chapter 10, p. 197)
Rabbi Yehuda ben Maharam Chalava (1300's):
What happened to Yaakov with Esav will happen to us in all generations, and we must prepare ourselves with prayer and gifts, but not with war. Scripture has prohibited this under oath.
Rabbi Tzvi Hirsch Lehren, Jewish community leader in Amsterdam (1844):
We also believe in what Chazal say (Kesubos 111a) that one of the oaths that Hashem made Israel swear is not to rebel against the nations of the world, and we are not permitted to take any action to come to the Promised Land. Even if we had 1,200,000 soldiers bearing swords and trained in warfare, we would not be allowed to ascend and conquer Eretz Yisroel; rather we must wait and hope until Hashem desires to redeem us and bring us to the inheritance of our forefathers, and all the nations will see that Hashem Tzevaos [the God of Armies] is our Redeemer. (Emphasis mine.)
Let me close out by sharing a recent twenty minute interview with one of my modern heroes, Rabbi Yisroel Dovid Weiss, who succinctly summarizes the problems -and the great evil- represented by those who would convert the religion of Judaism into the force for destruction it has now become.

Meanwhile, I'm not done with this topic. Come back to this page in a week or two and I'll discuss what became of the lost tribes of Israel. (Spoiler alert: they're not as lost as you might think.)



Connie Waterman said...

Precious husband,

Perfect timing for a much needed blog post!

Paula H said...

Rock, I couldn’t agree more. For myself I cannot take sides on this issue. The powers that are behind both Israel and Hamas are evil and the civilians pay the price on both sides. There are never any winners in war. When will the bloodshed end?
I have been praying that the brothers will remember their father Abraham as we all must.

Thank you for this post!!

Hal said...

I feel so refreshed to see someone else give a clear explanation of the extent of, what I feel are just some of the Latter-Day deceptions of the masses, as described in the Scriptures (ALL of them) in full swing at this time. There was one thing in your post that I do not feel sure about, however: "this push to create a homeland for the Jews in Palestine is ... contrary to His will." To me, this is like asking what came first: the chicken or the egg. It is amazing just how many "bad" things in the Scriptures have happened due to the will of God for the purposes of 'testing', or 'proving' us. If someone looks up the phrase: 'hooks in the jaws', we see that God is repeating the pattern in our day, that originated when God PURPOSELY put Egypt before Judah, and Judah relied upon Egypt instead of God. To me, when most people talk of worshipping 'other gods', they like to invoke images such as a golden calf, or money. How about throwing away liberty in the process of worshipping, and bowing down to puffed up mortal men, who themselves are rebellious against God? The Scriptures, for example, cite Pharaoh and the King of Tyre, in their hearts being lifted up to believe that they are gods, and that all those who act as their hands end up in hell with them. How do we, as imperfect judges, know for sure who the wheat, and who are the tares? After all, we had the old Prophet in 1 Kings 13 'prove' the Prophet from Judah, which resulted in his death; and Jeremiah was commanded to tempt the Rechabites to drink wine in the Temple. I will quote from Hosea 8:4, however: "They have set up kings, but not by me". I know that God says He gets no pleasure in him that dieth, but it is clear that his thoughts are higher than our thoughts, this life is one big test, and we need to constantly be in prayer to know what he would have us do to love, and warn our neighbors.

Brent Larsen said...

his is complex, except, not. our scriptures say “cry peace” they are the most correct set of scriptures that have been available to us EVER. we have our instructions See t&c 175:52

interesting that section 176 is next

Alan Rock Waterman said...

Thanks for your input and the link to Ben Shapiro's podcast, Brent. I watched Ben Shapiro's video a couple of weeks ago and though I often agree with him, I believe on this topic he is blinded by anger, which has put him in the camp that claims Israel has done no wrong and the other side deserves to be destroyed (even if that means the murder of innocents). Section 175:52 is indeed apropo here, especially where the Lord says "The time is short and I come quickly, therefore open your mouths and warn others to flee the wrath which is to come as men in anger destroy one another. The wicked shall destroy the wicked, and I will hold the peacemakers in the palm of my hand and none can take them from me."

Connie Waterman said...

Rock, I got this email from my friend Judy. She has limited internet use where she lives which makes it difficult for her to post this on your blog herself so she has asked me to post it here for her:

Thank you Connie! This was another amazing and informative post by Rock. Todd was reading it this morning and I came and joined him as I ate, and he started over, commenting as he went, "see how masterful this is!" He loved how Rock showed immediately that one doesn't need to take sides, as both sides are in the wrong and then went on to show the history and what the religious Jews feel on the subject.
I agree, it is a masterful article. I learned a lot, particularly concerning the Hasidic Jews view from the Torah and Rabbis throughout history concerning the fact that they are not to go back in mass and form a state, nor go against the current inhabitants of the land. I love how Rock uses original source material. That is how Todd taught me about government/economy and the principles of freedom. He went to the inspired people who wrote at the time and the scriptures. It is so much better than just asserting things with no back up. Plus truth is so beautiful, it stirs the soul.

Another thing I was unaware of was how the Hasidic Jews are being treated in Israel because of their religious convictions, disgusting; plus how the Zionists use the anti-semitism card in their defense while persecuting religious Jews, and the hypocrisy in their actions towards the inhabitants of the land.

I am against war and could see the telltale signs of them fomenting war in the propaganda on the mainstream media. I knew just a little about the Zionist movement being backed by the Rothchilds and the fact that Bibi Netanyahu's father had a different last name, that Bibi was a part of Mossad, he knew Epstein and is associated with the World Economic Forum. I was aware that he oversaw the almost complete vaccination of the state of Israel and his connections with the pharmaceutical companies. I have also heard that Netanyahu was quite unpopular at the time for what he was doing constitutionally in Israel and this is a "welcome" distraction for him. I do not see him as "good". Everybody is afraid to say false flag, but the way that Hamas made it through that heavily protected area and had free reign for 6-7 hours is very suspicious. And the bombing of civilians is abhorrent. Thank you for giving me more information to help me understand this difficult situation better and to share with others so that they may see more clearly.

I have also appreciated and found the other links you have sent concerning this catastrophy very helpful and informative. I appreciated this one, for his biblical defense against blood lust and the adversary's known tactic of stirring us up to anger.

Todd is hoping Rock will bring some more clarity to these two scriptures in his next article. We are looking forward to it!

Revelations 3:9 and 2:9
3:9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

2:9 I know thy works and tribulation and poverty (but thou art rich), and I know the blasphemy of them that say they are Jews and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

Please share our thoughts with Rock, or post them at his website if you'd like. May all the scales be removed from our eyes that we may see, hear and understand with our hearts and be healed is my prayer.

with much love and gratitude,


Linda Gale said...

Something smells worse than skunks about this war.

How is it that Israel has the most super-duper surveillance systems in the world and this just happened to slip by their attention?

Oh wait!

Turkey warned them 2 or 3 times. What!

Then in videos I've watched the 2 buildings that Hamas bombed "just happened" to freefall in their own footprints, kind of like what happened on America's 9/11.
indicating a planned demolition.

Then Bibi says it's Israel's 9/11.
You just can't make this stuff up!

Israel had a huge death toll from the "mexican beer bug" and its jab. So the population was already thinned greatly. Now they are going to get their soldiers killed en masse.
It's almost more than I can bear to think of war wiping out a generation of precious Israeli youths.

Alan Rock Waterman said...

Linda Gale,
It would be foolish indeed if we were to dismiss the possiblilty that Israel allowed this to happen. In that sense, Bibi Netanyahu may have been hinting at something he knew. Of course, the mainstream narrative won't allow the mere mention of the possibility, but we now know that Roosevelt's cabinet KNEW the Japanese would attack Pearl Harbor (and even made it easier for that attack to be successful) because the Germans would not fall for our government's attempts to goad Germany into drawing first blood. Roosevelt and many others wanted an excuse for America to go to war against Germany, and the attack by Germany's ally Japan gave them what they needed.

You don't want to get me started on the numerous questions that have been raised about 9/11. At the very least, elements in the U.S. government LET it happen, and there's plenty of reason to believe they greased the wheels to the extent that they saw to it that it WOULD happen.

The warmongering State of Israel has, for a long time, wanted an excuse to completely wipe out every man, woman, and child living in Gaza. The good news is they may not get away with it now, because it's one thing to react against the evil members of Hamas who conducted the attack, but the world is waking up to Israel's calls for genocide against the Palestinian people. Happily, blatant calls for genocide is where many Americans draw the line.

Alan Rock Waterman said...

Persuant to my response above to Linda Gale, Here is a link to a short but lively discussion on the Jimmy Dore Show regarding the liklihood that at the very least the Zionist State of Israel new about Hama's plans to shell Israel and allowed it to happen. There is no denying such an attack would give the Zonists the excuse they have always wanted to accomplish there long-time goal in the region.

Linda Gale said...

Dear Rock,

Thank you for even reading my comment.

I do tend to get a bit riled up when it comes to mass killings (war), especially since in Ukraine they will not have enough youth to grow up to be leaders, providers, and spouses. Heartbreaking is putting it mildly.

I'm sure that I am far from being alone, but all this "murder" (and killing for financial gain cannot honestly be called anything other than murder), just makes me wonder about the sanity of the human race.

How can we follow the Lord's admonition to "Love one another", when we are wantonly killing "the other"?

I am so disgusted with America's leaders. It's an embarrassment to US citizens everywhere that the US Military are the globe's bullies. Geez!

Alan Rock Waterman said...

I always read all the comments, Gale, especially yours. In most cases there's not much I can add to a reponse other than to say "ditto" which is why I WISH this plaform had a like button. Unfortunately it does not.

Any, "ditto," Linda!

Linda Gale said...

Happy Halloween Rock and Connie,

Thank you for the suggested video from The Jimmy Dore Show. I hadn't seen that one and it was very informative.

Col Macgregor is on the page with me, finally saying that it is a very stupid move, but there is a possibility that Nut-in-yahoo allowed this to happen, but if he calls for a cease-fire, his government will prosecute him on his ongoing corruption charges. If that is the case, then no wonder Bibi is telling the press that this will be a long war. He is looking out for his own skin.

I realize that you have to maintain a less controversial blog and there are things which you cannot state, without perhaps offending your readers who are not into conspiracy theories. Since so many of the theories have been proven true, I don't mind talking about them occasionally, but I understand your responsibility as the blog owner.

Thanks for the timely article. I am very passionate about not starting world war 3. I love humankind, and don't wish ill on anyone. But I hope for a time of peace and prosperity for everyone.

Rant over for now. Please forgive my wordiness.

HenrikMetz said...

Thanks for this video. I agree with your non violent approach. This is also the doctrine of the Book of Mormon, as you have explained in your script.
This is a never ending story. As the Doctrine and Covenants teaches in Section 63 vers 33 and other sections that there will be wars on the face of the earth in the last days and that the wicked will kill the wicked.
Anyway thanks for your wise words. Unfortunately the leaders of this world will not notice.
So we have to be prepared for ourselves for worse things to come. It is sad but it is what the scriptures teach.

Jim O'Rullian said...

Rock, so that I understand the logic, let me see if I can summarize:

Hamas in Gaza is BAD because they a warring, bloodthirsty people who want revenge for the land that was taken away from them 50 years ago by a more advanced civilization capable of industry, education, democracy and defense through military strength. But the Palestinian people in Gaza are GOOD because they are peaceful non-combatants caught in the middle used as pawns by the ruling body.

Modern secular Jews are BAD because they don’t understand the scriptures which tell them not to form a secular nation, but rather to accept their lot and take their stripes as God’s way of purifying them until a supernatural event occurs in the last days (the promised Messiah rebuilding the temple and establishing the Jews in Jerusalem). But the orthodox Jews are GOOD because they are peaceful non-combatants caught in the middle used as pawns by the ruling body.

And finally, the Jewish people had been doing just fine living amongst all nations following the diaspora and treated relatively well by their mother countries (which include the Ottoman Turks and the German Nazis). Sure, they lost about 6 million of their kin to a genocide, but they had it coming to them anyway status/post Sinai via the curse of God. Overall, things would have been much better for them if they would NOT have been awarded real estate in the Holy Land and just continued on their Levitical nomadic course.

If I’m following the argument correctly, it seems to be suggesting three things: 1) although no group is better than another, the non-combatant groups on each side are more “GOOD” and the combatant groups on each side are more “BAD”, 2) the Holy Land should be awarded to the Arab nations which will pacify their hatred for the Jews who will then be given safe harbor somewhere in the land as their countrymen so long as they abide by Muslim law, 3) no other country should be involved in the conflict, but rather sue for peace and wish them well. I think there are a lot of over-simplified assumptions in that which could be challenged. But let’s throw out ALL arguments about religion, morality, virtue and GOOD/BAD for the moment, because that’s really not at the heart of the conflict anyway.

Regardless of how a country was formed or given the power to form, when and where in history have we ever seen conquered real estate, won by blood and iron, be given back to the conquered people because they were there first? Hasn’t there always been somebody there first? Instead, boundaries in the modern world have been defined by who conquered the land and whether or not they could defend it thereafter against other invaders who would come later. Invaders who cared more about the preservation of human life than they did about conquest might test the boundaries for a time until enough loss of life dictated concession of the real estate and a peaceful path forward. By contrast, invaders who cared more about conquest than they did about human life, continually made war against the boundaries until those being invaded got tired of the threat and loss of life to its citizens, that they eliminated the threat decisively and then promptly returned home with the respect of its adversaries. In fact, I can’t think of another example in history like Israel, who possesses the kind of military dominance they do, that has put up with the testing of its boundaries and killing of its citizens this long and not completely decimated the threat. The US would NEVER put up with that for even a day. One could argue that it is because of this lack of decisive action on the part of Israel decades ago that we are in the situation we are in now with an Iranian nuclear threat in play.

Jim O'Rullian said...

Don’t take a side and sue for peace? Of course, and that’s all we can and should do. But that message is more/less a given goes out to all nations and people whether at war with countries or at war with our next-door neighbor over who owns the fruit that falls over the fence. The current boundaries of the real estate known as Israel have been hard won by the same community of like-minded people many times over and they seem entitled to defend themselves against the loss of life to ALL of its’ citizens whether secular Jew, orthodox Jew, Christian, or any other. They have not demonstrated themselves to be motivated by conquest but rather the defense of their lives and liberty. Given all that has gone on before and now most recently with this unprecedented coordinated attack, the leadership of the country is obligated to eliminate the threat on their borders the same as any parent of a family would be obligated to defend his/her home against a murderous robber in the middle of the night. Mormon was disgusted with all sides of the conflict in his day, but he too took up the sword in defense of his family and friends. It’s clear that the effort will not be quick and decisive this time as in times past because the measures of retaliation are greater and will draw other nations into the conflict as the scriptures predict. The Lord’s sheep exist on every side of every conflict and He knows who still considers who's blood precious still. He will lead them out; we have his promise on that.

As for whether or not the Jews would have been better off not forming a state and defending their borders, there is another group of people, from whom I descend, that provide a good example of how well that would have worked out for them. The Armenians, living under Turkish rule during the Ottoman empire, were the recipients of a larger mass genocide than the Jews during the Holocaust years. They chose to take the nomadic course and dispersed throughout the world rather than fortify and build up their ability to defend their real estate. Today they remain an industrious people among all nations, but their homeland has become little more than a vassal state to their Muslim neighbors who still hate and murder them with impunity while the world ignores their struggle. There has been no season of peace in return for their acquiescence. They have been unable to establish meaningful industry, commerce, higher education or government in their war-torn tiny country. One need only look to the Armenian people as a case study in what “would” have happened if a group of people calling themselves Israel had not defined their borders and defended them 50 years ago.

Rhone said...

The Book of Mormon teaches all that we need to know about the state of things. You have one side that is wicked because of the false traditions of their fathers. They are easily riled up and hate their brethren. There is another side that is supposedly more enlightened and has access to the scriptures and commandments of God. Yet they too are wicked. Their government is full of secret combinations and they conspire to overthrow the freedom of their people. The victims are the civilians who are caught in the middle.

Cpt. Moroni provides the perfect example of how we are to act. We are to avoid war at all costs. We are to proclaim peace. We are to defend ourselves to the shedding of blood if necessary. We are never to wage offensive war unless specifically authorized by God himself. People seem to forget that the scriptures specifically state that if all men were like Moroni then Satan would have no power. It's that simple.

War sucks. However, we need to remember that death has no sting. All things happen according to the will of the Lord. He will receive the innocents into himself. They are not lost to him.

Linda Gale said...

Israel is getting pummeled in the news, and rightfully so, as they dropped a bomb in a refugee camp killing 400 people.

Their purpose, their stated purpose. was to get 1 (one) terrorist. They bombed a refugee camp ! ! ! Where people cannot run and cannot hide.

Then the Israeli military tells them, the refugees, to move! ! ! What????

Move where? They are supposedly in a non-military zone.

Meanwhile the world is turning against Israel for such wanton killing.
Israel will continue searching for the Evil-doers, until the innocents are forcefully driven out of Palestine, or are in their graves. Not a good option for the civilians.

And turning the people of the world against Israel is not good for Israel either.
Jimmy Dore calls out the hypocrisy

Jim O'Rullian said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Julene Humes said...

Rock,I cannot tell you how important your work has been to my understanding of things "as they really are." This latest post is a good example. Thank you, thank you for this info. It is so hard for me to hear Mormons support Israel because they think their presence in the Holy Land is fulfillment of prophecy. This explains so much.

John Peterson said...


Great work as usual. You are a peacemaker, and JESUS blesses them.

I cannot remember any words from GOD like "blessed are the warmongers for they shall kill in my name."

I had to create a new blog to replace my old one (

My new blog is

I hope you will link it to your awesome site so I can continue to reach a few people.

John Scott Peterson

Alan Rock Waterman said...

Jim O'Rullian,
If I understand what you are saying in your "summary" of my argument, you appear to have ascribed to me positions I have not taken, while oversimplifying situations that are extremely complicated. In reality, the situation between the State of Israel and its neighbors has become intractable. Hamas spokesman Ghazi Hamad has made it clear that he is willing to sacrifice the lives of all palestinians if that's what it takes to eliminate all Israelis, and the Zionist leadership of the state of Israel appears willing to do the same. This is the situation we find ourselves in now, and unfortunately many Americans are only too willing to participate in escalating this insanity.

You write, "If I’m following the argument correctly [you aren't], it seems to be suggesting 1) although no group is better than another, the non-combatant groups on each side are more “GOOD” and the combatant groups on each side are more “BAD”, 2) the Holy Land should be awarded to the Arab nations which will pacify their hatred for the Jews..."

First, although one may conclude that I consider "combatant groups" on either side are "BAD" I would make the clarification that it is not so much the combatants as it is those in leadership positions on both sides egging those combatants on. Where you actually mischaractirize me is in your assumption that I believe the non-combatants are "GOOD." I never said they were good. I consider the common residents on both sides to be innocent victims of the results of actions taken by those in power.

But it is in your second point that you have inadvertently hit on the crux of your error, Jim. The Holy Land should never have been "awarded" to ANYONE. Despite their religious differences, Jews, Muslims and Christians had been peacefully living in that area for centuries since the Romans left, and yes, all of them had been getting along, as you would have learned had you watched the video interview I included with Rabbi Dovid Weiss. It was never religious differences that eventually divided that area, but the influence of outsiders who kicked the people out of their own houses and gave those homes to the people the outsiders favored.

It was only after the land was "awarded" to the Zionists through the machinations of the Rothschild family (who did not own it) via the British government (who did not own it) and finally by way of a declaration of the United Nations (which also did not own it). None of the entities that "awarded" the Holy Land to a specific group of people had any conceivable right to award any of that land to Jews, Muslims, Christians, or anyone else. Look at it this way: if the United Nations had been around in the 1830s and awarded Missouri exclusively to the Mormons while disposessing the non-Mormons who already lived there, would that act have been any more legitimate?

(Continued Below)

Alan Rock Waterman said...

Jim O'Rullian (continued)

There is a reason so many orthodox Jews (the ones who follow the Torah as I quoted in my piece) were smart enough not to move to Palestine. They recognized it was a con, and so they safely remained in the countries they have lived in for generations. Their brethren were fooled into believing that Palestine now represented a safe harbor for Jews to live in, which any fool can now see is not. Orthodox Jews in America have carved out homes for themselves that are much more preferable than living in that powder keg in the Middle East. Have you seen the Crown Heights section of New York? Even as a practicing Mormon I would feel right at home living among those people, even if that neighborhood is in New York. I would NOT feel safe living among Jews in the state of Israel

As the saying goes, Jim, there's a lot to unpack in your commentary, much of which would have been covered by today had I written my followup piece this weekend. But alas, the Missus and I have been struggling through some nasty bouts of flu so that will have to wait. I will say, however, that I fully agree with your position that the horrific Armenian genocide has been virtually ignored by modern historians while the Jewish holocaust continues to get all the press. The plight of the Armenians has been a concern of mine for many decades. But then, Armenians don't have anything at all like the powerful Israel Lobby keeping their interests front and center in the public view.

I submit that your response was an over-simplification of my message, Jim. I would encourage you to go back and read my actual words, and then follow that up by checking out the links I have provided. It would also be beneficial to take a look at earlier interviews by Rabbi Weiss. My initial essay is, admittedly, merely an overview. I hope to flesh out my argument in upcoming posts.

Alan Rock Waterman said...

John Peterson,
I empathize with your inability to access your own blog. I'm not sure how I would get inside of this one if it didn't come up automatically in Windows, since I have long since forgotten my own password.

Anyway, I added your new blog to my blogroll, which readers can find under the title "Joseph Smith Commentary." Your previous blog can still be found there under the title "Joseph Smith Translation."

Alan Rock Waterman said...

Linda Gale,
Thanks for that link to the Jimmy Dore Show. Jimmy Dore, former comedian and self-described "progressive," has become a very astute critic of the Democratic party and the loonier positions of the left. Although in my opinion he still retains a couple of blind spots (he maintains, for example, that taxing some citizens to benefit others is a legitimate role of government) he is an outspoken critic of people who have adopted the label "liberal" when they act illiberally.

I would encourage readers to check out recent videos on his YouTube channel. He has been staying right on top of the controversy in Palestine.

Here is that link again:

Alan Rock Waterman said...

On the topic of the Jimmy Dore show, his guest host is today dealing with a topic that should be of interest to readers of my current blog post. You don't think there's dissension among the Jews on this topic? Here they present a video of police brutally attacking Anti-Zionist Jews In Israel:

John Peterson said...


Thank you kind sir.

John Scott

Sharese said...

Thank you, Rock, for yet another excellent post!

Jim O'Rullian said...

Thanks for taking the time to respond to my comment in detail Rock. You are a gifted writer and what I’ve always enjoyed most about your blog is way you can simplify very complex topics to make it consumable to most of us commoners. Part 2 of this series was likewise written well and you’ve done a nice job summarizing thousands of years of Israelite history there. I don’t disagree with your assessment of the identity of modern-day Jews, in fact I think you are spot when you say those who claim real estate title to the mid-East by divine decree do so under a false flag.

My comments on this topic were written in the same spirit of simplification that you employ and I recognize that there are some flaws to this approach and humbly admit my own. But in your response to them, you didn’t address the overarching point I was making at all and I wondered if you would please opine.

In my view, the issue is about the realities and practicalities of where we are today, regardless of how we got here or who claims to be who or which land belongs to which people (although admittedly it is a very interesting topic and worth investigation as you have done). At this point, the occupants of the various nations are those who have demonstrated that they have the capability of defending their borders against the conquest of other nations and/or demonstrated that they would rather concede the fight with their neighbors in exchange for peace rather than sacrifice the lives of their citizens in endless bouts of fighting in order to reclaim what they feel has been taken from them. Concerning the mid-East with all bad actors set aside for the moment, it appears that we have one group of people today who have demonstrated themselves to be generally peaceful and who have only used force to defend themselves amidst continual assault from the other side of the border where there lives a people whose children are trained form their youth to hate and kill their neighbors at any cost in order to reclaim what was taken from them over 50 years ago. The peaceful side of the border has leveraged its wealth to construct a functioning democratic government, thriving industry, institutions of higher learning and have a general respect for the lives of its citizens. The resentful side of the border has leveraged what little wealth and international aid they have received to amass explosives and build hundreds of miles of underground tunnels under the border to deploy them covertly. They establish their military command centers under hospitals and schools where people with any humanity would not target thus creating human shields out of its citizens. (Again this is oversimplified because obviously there are good people on each side of the conflict caught in middle who will die as a result of the actions of others).

I take it as a given that the entirely of the world is lost and fallen with only a few humble followers of Christ left over whom the Lord MAY work with. He knows his sheep and has a plan to gather them on both sides of the world. It’s likely that NONE of the boundaries of the nations or the people who live within them will exist when the Lord returns in judgment. That said, we also don’t know WHEN these events will occur although it appears imminent. Until that point, don’t the leaders of ANY nation have the right and obligation to defend their citizens by eliminating the threats on their borders, particularly when precipitated by years of attacks culminating in a massacre such as the one on October 7th? Would we stand idly by if Canada or Mexico did the same to us?

As one of your readers commented, “War sucks. However, we need to remember that death has no sting. All things happen according to the will of the Lord. He will receive the innocents into himself. They are not lost to him.”

Alan Rock Waterman said...

Jim O'Rullian,
You ask if I have a solution. I don't. Both sides in this conflict, (if we are talking about the Zionist government and the Palestinian Hamas) are intractable. Neither set of "leaders" will give.

Regarding the trope that "Israel has a right to protect its borders" well, that's the problem. Israel's "borders" keep expanding into the lands that never belonged to the Israelis in the first place. What about the palestinians (Christians, Muslims AND Jews) who were already living there for hundreds of years in peace before the Zionists literally began pushing them out of there homes, farms, and vineyards and moving in? Don't you think those people had the right to defend themselves?

Palestine truly is an open air prison, as you've doubtless heard, and it would not be hard for a group of radical extremists to convince their fellow citizens that enough is enough. Many, Many Jewish historians such as Norman Finkelstein, Shlomo Sand, Ilan Pappe, Avi Schlaim and others are horrified at the horrors the Zionist leaders have perpetrated on the people who have the actual right to the land. (You can find their books on Amazon and you can find interviews online where they share their findings).

Scholars have already proven that the stories about Hamas building tunnels and keeping arms under schools and hospitals are mere propaganda pushed by the Zionists. The fog of war is a breeding ground for propaganda, and that very propaganda has enabled the corrupt Zionist government to excuse themselves for committing war crimes against innocents. What they really want to do is completely exterminate the people living in Gaza; they have admitted to that.

In short, I don't have a solution to this dog's breakfast; all I'm trying to do is point out that things are not as they seem, and that Americans would be mistaken to side with Israel because we have been fooled into believing they are God's Chosen people. I'd hate to face the savior at the judgment bar and have to try to justify my support of the actions of evil men because I swallowed that lie and failed to look deeper.

The Jews who were tricked into moving to Palestine are controled by the Zionists, who, you'll remember, are acting contrary to the religion they claim authority under. Meanwhile the Palestinian people are trapped between the Zionists and the Hamas leaders, who have vowed to spill the blood of their own people so long as they get to kill all the Jews. So as far as I can see, the situation is intractable until a majority of Jews come to the realization that none of this is approved by God. If the Jews believed in the words of the true Messiah, I doubt they would continue to justify the actions of those who currently rule over them. That's the only solution I see: a national repentance.

Michael Waterman said...

Not a bad piece. I would like to see more on Netanyahu and his funding of Hamas.
“Anyone who wants to prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state needs to support strengthening Hamas.” -Netanyahu in 2019